The Asian Commercial Sex Scene  

Go Back   The Asian Commercial Sex Scene > For stuff you can't discuss with your Facebook Account > Adult Discussions about SEX

Notices

Adult Discussions about SEX Misc chit chat about sex, whores, girls, love and lust. This section is a ZAP FREE zone.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #8701  
Old 06-01-2023, 11:29 PM
starbucks's Avatar
starbucks starbucks is offline
Samster
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 430
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 93 Post(s)
My Reputation: Points: 752 / Power: 14
starbucks is a splendid one to beholdstarbucks is a splendid one to beholdstarbucks is a splendid one to beholdstarbucks is a splendid one to beholdstarbucks is a splendid one to beholdstarbucks is a splendid one to beholdstarbucks is a splendid one to behold
Re: How To Get And Keep Attractive Gals Of Your Type

Good sharing and good reminder!! Thanks!!


Quote:
Originally Posted by warbird View Post
Good afternoon,

What an auspicious day!

I have mentioned that if a man is non-needy and nonreactive when dealing with very attractive girls (including his dream girls), he will be perceived to have HIGH status and HIGH social and sexual value. Yes, he is the PRIZE.

I like to share the following by Mystery:

Emotional Reactions are Proportionate
to the Value Differential


The greater the potential impact to my own value, the greater emotional
reaction I will have. If someone points a gun in my face, I will immediately
feel a rush of emotions in my body. But if a child points a toy
gun at me, I feel nothing. Why? Some part of my programming has
calculated the potential impact to my survival value and then activated
the appropriate emotion.

If an attractive woman pursues me, it is more validating than if
the unattractive woman does the same. If my boss (the rich man)
frowns at me, I will feel a sinking feeling in my stomach—I will know
that I have just screwed up. But if the beggar frowns at me, I feel no
regret at all.

People normally feel stronger emotions in response to social feedback
from those of higher value. The more attractive women tend to
cause men to feel more intense emotions.

How else could people even determine who they are attracted to
in the first place, if they didn’t feel attraction? Acceptance from an
attractive woman feels more pleasurable, yet she also causes more
anxiety—because some part of our programming has decided that
she is more important. People will react to her, they will try to impress
her more, and they will try to not “fuck it up.”

She feels this vibe (it’s obvious), and the frame it sets is that she
must be the one with higher value. After all, if I am reacting more to
her than she is to me, then I must be feeling more powerful emotions
than she is—which means that I must view her as higher value than
she views me.

My lower value is thus telegraphed to her—and to everyone else
around—through my emotional reactions. Subtle cues in my behavior
cause the general perception of my value to drop.

The person who is reacting more is the one in that moment with lower relative value.

REACTION AND RELATIVE VALUE


Since emotionally reactive behaviors will telegraph lower value, then
can we also assume that being emotionally unreactive will convey
higher value?

In our experience, this is true—being unreactive is a powerful
way to convey status and generate attraction.

Of course, this doesn’t mean to act emotionless and robotic. It
only means that you shouldn’t have any more nervousness around
attractive people than you would around anyone else. Rather, you
are able to just be yourself and act as you would around your close
friends and family.

If your two-year-old niece tells you “you’re stupid,”—do you get
nervous? Do you try to come up with the perfect response? Do you
care? Most likely the comment passes through without affecting you,
and you just laugh and toy with her. You wouldn’t remember her saying
it and you wouldn’t feel your status and value as a man have been lowered. This should be the same
with people you feel attracted to.

When people sense that you aren’t reacting to them, the vibe feels
to them like you just don’t perceive them as any great threat, or benefit,
to your own value. Instead, you come across as completely unaffected,
in good humor, and able to interact comfortably just as if you were relaxing with your oldest friends. This vibe causes people to treat you
as if you have higher status.

What does it mean when people treat you like you have a higher
status?

Women will find you more attractive.

People in general will have more emotional reactions to you and they will feel more validation
or devalidation based upon your responses to them.

People will be more concerned with gaining your approval and avoiding your
disapproval. People will more easily alter their opinions or behavior
in order to accommodate you.

People will seek rapport with you, offer you value, and will try to align with you. All of these behaviors
are indicators of interest—clues that reveal that person’s subconscious
perception of the value differential.
  #8702  
Old 08-01-2023, 10:08 PM
warbird warbird is offline
Samster
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Gotham City
Posts: 3,888
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 580 Post(s)
My Reputation: Points: 7306 / Power: 0
warbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond repute
Re: How To Get And Keep Attractive Gals Of Your Type

Quote:
Originally Posted by starbucks View Post
Good sharing and good reminder!! Thanks!!
Bro, pleasure is all mine.

I also need to remind myself as it's very easy to have momentary lapses, especially if the girl is exceptionally attractive or is a "Special One."

I have benefited so much by sharing. It's a win-win situation.

Cheers!
Bro WB
  #8703  
Old 09-01-2023, 02:33 PM
teddybeartim teddybeartim is offline
Samster
 
Join Date: Dec 2022
Posts: 31
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
My Reputation: Points: 78 / Power: 0
teddybeartim deserves a Tiger! - He's a Good Guy
Re: How To Get And Keep Attractive Gals Of Your Type

Quote:
Originally Posted by warbird View Post
Bro, you're right!
hard to find girls that think this way now
  #8704  
Old 09-01-2023, 06:44 PM
SadLoser SadLoser is offline
Samster
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,145
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 609 Post(s)
My Reputation: Points: 1688 / Power: 16
SadLoser has a brilliant futureSadLoser has a brilliant futureSadLoser has a brilliant futureSadLoser has a brilliant futureSadLoser has a brilliant futureSadLoser has a brilliant futureSadLoser has a brilliant futureSadLoser has a brilliant futureSadLoser has a brilliant futureSadLoser has a brilliant futureSadLoser has a brilliant future
Re: How To Get And Keep Attractive Gals Of Your Type

Quote:
Originally Posted by warbird View Post
Good afternoon,

What an auspicious day!

I have mentioned that if a man is non-needy and nonreactive when dealing with very attractive girls (including his dream girls), he will be perceived to have HIGH status and HIGH social and sexual value. Yes, he is the PRIZE.

I like to share the following by Mystery:

Emotional Reactions are Proportionate
to the Value Differential

Great sharings and I have always enjoyed reading your posts on attracting women. They are great advice and I agree with most of them.

However I wished to point out - it's not that easy for a guy to attract woman simply by being non-needy and nonreactive.

In this era, every girl even those 5/10 average plain jane seems to have a trunkload of simps chasing & fighting for her attention.

Esp with social media and dating apps these days, women gets endless validations and they get flooded by hundreds of msgs every week and they get to pick & choose the best guy according to their preference. Basically the world is their oyster now, especially so if the gal is young & pretty

So if you try to enhance your own value by being non-needy and nonreactive, the gal will simply drop you as there is always another simp waiting to feed her with attention & worship her like a princess.

This is a world-wide phenomenon and a US youtuber also shared his dating experience:


As dating apps & social media become the norm these days, gals are receiving far more validations, ego-boosting messages & becoming increasingly demanding & entitled.

Unless you are the top 20% guy in terms of attraction - i.e.tall, handsome, rich - you hardly stand a chance to even connect with her, much less trying to attract her with any attraction methods.
Many guys experienced the same struggles/challenges.
  #8705  
Old 10-01-2023, 10:46 AM
junior_cannibal's Avatar
junior_cannibal junior_cannibal is offline
Samster
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,958
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1235 Post(s)
My Reputation: Points: 3007 / Power: 22
junior_cannibal has a reputation beyond reputejunior_cannibal has a reputation beyond reputejunior_cannibal has a reputation beyond reputejunior_cannibal has a reputation beyond reputejunior_cannibal has a reputation beyond reputejunior_cannibal has a reputation beyond reputejunior_cannibal has a reputation beyond reputejunior_cannibal has a reputation beyond reputejunior_cannibal has a reputation beyond reputejunior_cannibal has a reputation beyond reputejunior_cannibal has a reputation beyond repute
Re: How To Get And Keep Attractive Gals Of Your Type

Bro WB, about your friend, Liu with a young wife and tenant, I hope he's aware that the young ladies could have also invited their male friends over and among which, the fathers of their babies.
How to connect emotionally with a 28 when he's 68? When he's 75, she's only 35. True love? Especially if he's just an average Joe and she's financially independent.
TBH, as long as the man's health is good, he could still impregnant a woman even if he's 90.
__________________
己所不欲,勿施于人
If you like what I comment or post, feel free to comment or give me your oranges.
If it's merely for the exchange of oranges, I don't. Sorry about that.
  #8706  
Old 14-01-2023, 10:24 PM
warbird warbird is offline
Samster
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Gotham City
Posts: 3,888
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 580 Post(s)
My Reputation: Points: 7306 / Power: 0
warbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond repute
Re: How To Get And Keep Attractive Gals Of Your Type

Quote:
Originally Posted by teddybeartim View Post
hard to find girls that think this way now
Tks for your post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SadLoser View Post
Great sharings and I have always enjoyed reading your posts on attracting women. They are great advice and I agree with most of them.

However I wished to point out - it's not that easy for a guy to attract woman simply by being non-needy and nonreactive.

In this era, every girl even those 5/10 average plain jane seems to have a trunkload of simps chasing & fighting for her attention.

Esp with social media and dating apps these days, women gets endless validations and they get flooded by hundreds of msgs every week and they get to pick & choose the best guy according to their preference. Basically the world is their oyster now, especially so if the gal is young & pretty

So if you try to enhance your own value by being non-needy and nonreactive, the gal will simply drop you as there is always another simp waiting to feed her with attention & worship her like a princess.

This is a world-wide phenomenon and a US youtuber also shared his dating experience:


As dating apps & social media become the norm these days, gals are receiving far more validations, ego-boosting messages & becoming increasingly demanding & entitled.

Unless you are the top 20% guy in terms of attraction - i.e.tall, handsome, rich - you hardly stand a chance to even connect with her, much less trying to attract her with any attraction methods.
Many guys experienced the same struggles/challenges.
Bro, tks for your opinions.

The brief article on emotional reactions is written by Mystery. I agree with most of what he has written.

Being nonreactive and non-needy alone won't get a man anywhere. Because a psycho or mentally retarded male could also appear nonreactive. A man needs to have many other positive masculine character traits and he should be totally detached to the outcomes.

Is average plain Jane being chased by many simps? I feel very sorry for these males.

A MAN should never settle. He gets and keeps the prettiest young women or SYTs of his type. That was why I started this thread.

Cheers!

Quote:
Originally Posted by junior_cannibal View Post
Bro WB, about your friend, Liu with a young wife and tenant, I hope he's aware that the young ladies could have also invited their male friends over and among which, the fathers of their babies.
How to connect emotionally with a 28 when he's 68? When he's 75, she's only 35. True love? Especially if he's just an average Joe and she's financially independent.
TBH, as long as the man's health is good, he could still impregnant a woman even if he's 90.
Bro, tks.

The story about Mr. Liu is supposed to be a joke.

What is true love? Nothing in this universe will last forever. But L and I are soulmates.

Cheers

......................................

Wishing every samster a happy, healthy, and prosperous Lunar New Year!

Good night,

Bro WB
  #8707  
Old 14-01-2023, 10:48 PM
WILHD WILHD is offline
Samster
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Airport
Posts: 214
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 140 Post(s)
My Reputation: Points: 663 / Power: 5
WILHD is a splendid one to beholdWILHD is a splendid one to beholdWILHD is a splendid one to beholdWILHD is a splendid one to beholdWILHD is a splendid one to beholdWILHD is a splendid one to behold
Re: How To Get And Keep Attractive Gals Of Your Type

Quote:
Originally Posted by warbird View Post
Is average plain Jane being chased by many simps? I feel very sorry for these males.

A MAN should never settle. He gets and keeps the prettiest young women or SYTs of his type. That was why I started this thread.

Cheers!
You shouldn't be sorry for them. They are very toxic human beings. I had to bear with these simp types. They are more than just bringing up the value of girls who don't deserve it, they are also jealous even in terms of friendship. I had to do with the jealousy of a simp towards a girl he didn't even care about because I grew closer to her in one month than him in five years.

I say: we should leave the plain Janes to them. No need to settle, and even Jane does not settle for a man with no dignity and in a need for another mother.

Your posts are always full of wisdom and it's nice to see you post in this main section as well.

Cheers.
  #8708  
Old 15-01-2023, 05:39 PM
uglywin uglywin is offline
Samster
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
My Reputation: Points: 115 / Power: 7
uglywin deserves two Tigers! - He's a Great Guyuglywin deserves two Tigers! - He's a Great Guy
Re: How To Get And Keep Attractive Gals Of Your Type

Great thread bro warbird. Thanks for sharing valuable information and tips!
  #8709  
Old 18-01-2023, 12:05 PM
Cowell's Avatar
Cowell Cowell is offline
Samster
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 165
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 28 Post(s)
My Reputation: Points: 62 / Power: 0
Cowell deserves a Tiger! - He's a Good Guy
Re: How To Get And Keep Attractive Gals Of Your Type

Quote:
Originally Posted by vazuatu View Post
Lovely side boob
That was nice
  #8710  
Old 20-01-2023, 02:04 AM
harlowboy harlowboy is offline
Samster
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 7
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
My Reputation: Points: 48 / Power: 0
harlowboy deserves a Tiger! - He's a Good Guy
Hi warbird,

I am curious about how to keep your girlfriend in the gap.
I can get women but always fail to keep them for more than 6 months.
I wonder if its because i m unable to keep the lady in the gap after we are in a serious relationship

Quote:
Originally Posted by warbird View Post
Tks, bro.

.................................................

Good evening,

I have a short article to share.

NEVER do this with a girl you like...


If you’ve ever wanted to confess your feelings


And tell a girl just how much you like her…


STOP!


Don’t do it, man.


Telling her how you feel


Is one of the DUMBEST things you could do.


I know it might sound harsh…


But if you want her to truly want you…


Think about you sexually…


And maybe even fall for you...


Then you have to make her UNCERTAIN about you.


Keep her on her toes,


So she never knows for sure whether you like her or not.


My buddy Mike calls this Keeping Her in “The Gap.”


According to Mike:


“The Gap is that uncertain grey area between ‘he likes me’ and ‘he’s not interested.”


You always want to keep women in “The Gap.”

Best,
Ryan


Short and sweet. Great tip though.

Cheers!

Bro WB
  #8711  
Old 20-01-2023, 05:39 AM
WiseGuy's Avatar
WiseGuy WiseGuy is offline
Samster
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 181
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 45 Post(s)
My Reputation: Points: 168 / Power: 13
WiseGuy is a Helpful and Caring SamsterWiseGuy is a Helpful and Caring Samster
Re: How To Get And Keep Attractive Gals Of Your Type

Quote:
Originally Posted by SadLoser View Post
As dating apps & social media become the norm these days, gals are receiving far more validations, ego-boosting messages & becoming increasingly demanding & entitled
Indeed bro
  #8712  
Old 22-01-2023, 11:52 AM
warbird warbird is offline
Samster
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Gotham City
Posts: 3,888
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 580 Post(s)
My Reputation: Points: 7306 / Power: 0
warbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond reputewarbird has a reputation beyond repute
Re: How To Get And Keep Attractive Gals Of Your Type

Quote:
Originally Posted by WILHD View Post
You shouldn't be sorry for them. They are very toxic human beings. I had to bear with these simp types. They are more than just bringing up the value of girls who don't deserve it, they are also jealous even in terms of friendship. I had to do with the jealousy of a simp towards a girl he didn't even care about because I grew closer to her in one month than him in five years.

I say: we should leave the plain Janes to them. No need to settle, and even Jane does not settle for a man with no dignity and in a need for another mother.

Your posts are always full of wisdom and it's nice to see you post in this main section as well.

Cheers.
Bro, tks.

You're right. Too many simps n beta males around. They are losers.

Even ugly aunties will find them repulsive.

Quote:
Originally Posted by uglywin View Post
Great thread bro warbird. Thanks for sharing valuable information and tips!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cowell View Post
That was nice
Tks, bros.

Quote:
Originally Posted by harlowboy View Post
Hi warbird,

I am curious about how to keep your girlfriend in the gap.
I can get women but always fail to keep them for more than 6 months.
I wonder if its because i m unable to keep the lady in the gap after we are in a serious relationship
Bro,

You will keep your GF or "special one" in the gap permanently as long as you know you hv higher social and sexual value, in your subconscious mind, and you always keep your power in the relationship.

Sorry to sound like a broken record. You must do so from the first second you meet her to the last second you're with her. Whether you have been with her for 3 minutes or 30 years.

Your dreams would reveal your subconscious beliefs and confidence. You can't cheat yourself. If you ever dream that she is the prize or that you're worried she may be leaving you, you hv LOST. You will need years of mental reprogramming. Most men can't understand this simple fact. That is why they think I'm all BS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WiseGuy View Post
Indeed bro
Tks.
.................................................. .....

Good morning,

Wishing everyone a happy, healthy and prosperous Lunar New Year 2023!

Huat Ah!

Bro WB

Last edited by warbird; 22-01-2023 at 02:24 PM.
  #8713  
Old 25-01-2023, 04:10 PM
leakypipes's Avatar
leakypipes leakypipes is offline
Samster
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: lalalaland
Posts: 414
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 51 Post(s)
My Reputation: Points: 1036 / Power: 20
leakypipes has much to be proud ofleakypipes has much to be proud ofleakypipes has much to be proud ofleakypipes has much to be proud ofleakypipes has much to be proud ofleakypipes has much to be proud ofleakypipes has much to be proud ofleakypipes has much to be proud of
Re: How To Get And Keep Attractive Gals Of Your Type

Only now that I am middle-aged, that this thread begins to make more sense.

I have had occasional successes in my 30s, but my hit rate in the last two years went up considerably - despite COVID.

What changed? Well, I went through some personal shit, but came out of it learning to care less what other people think about me. And focussed on improving myself. I have always been confident, but I also had a deeply insecure side and always look for validation from others.

Now, the only validation I want is from myself. And I am not interested in impressing others, least of all another woman, no matter how attractive they are.

Because based on the last two years alone, I am confident that if I want you, I will get you.
__________________
Thanks for the memories to the OG D1 OKTs who provide good service.

Stables that get honest FRs removed - FO&D.
  #8714  
Old 25-01-2023, 07:18 PM
EtherC EtherC is offline
Samster
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 598
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 46 Post(s)
My Reputation: Points: 990 / Power: 23
EtherC is a splendid one to beholdEtherC is a splendid one to beholdEtherC is a splendid one to beholdEtherC is a splendid one to beholdEtherC is a splendid one to beholdEtherC is a splendid one to beholdEtherC is a splendid one to beholdEtherC is a splendid one to behold
Re: How To Get And Keep Attractive Gals Of Your Type

Great to hear that, the needy vibe has been cleansed. Women can sense if a man is needy/ desperate. Being relaxed, fun, confident and at ease is very attractive!

Having $ is just a multiplier, a man can be rich but still be needy. And that’s when he ends up attracting gold diggers.


Quote:
Originally Posted by leakypipes View Post
Only now that I am middle-aged, that this thread begins to make more sense.

I have had occasional successes in my 30s, but my hit rate in the last two years went up considerably - despite COVID.

What changed? Well, I went through some personal shit, but came out of it learning to care less what other people think about me. And focussed on improving myself. I have always been confident, but I also had a deeply insecure side and always look for validation from others.

Now, the only validation I want is from myself. And I am not interested in impressing others, least of all another woman, no matter how attractive they are.

Because based on the last two years alone, I am confident that if I want you, I will get you.
  #8715  
Old 25-01-2023, 11:37 PM
leakypipes's Avatar
leakypipes leakypipes is offline
Samster
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: lalalaland
Posts: 414
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 51 Post(s)
My Reputation: Points: 1036 / Power: 20
leakypipes has much to be proud ofleakypipes has much to be proud ofleakypipes has much to be proud ofleakypipes has much to be proud ofleakypipes has much to be proud ofleakypipes has much to be proud ofleakypipes has much to be proud ofleakypipes has much to be proud of
Quote:
Originally Posted by EtherC View Post
Great to hear that, the needy vibe has been cleansed. Women can sense if a man is needy/ desperate. Being relaxed, fun, confident and at ease is very attractive!

Having $ is just a multiplier, a man can be rich but still be needy. And that’s when he ends up attracting gold diggers.
Very true. Frankly, i feel my 30s success is all because of material. I had $ to spare. Ok la i still got $ to spare but what's the point?

Nowadays, i almost feel like I'm living the fantasy i had in my 20s and 30s - and you're right, removing the needy vibe is vital! Must maintain that power dynamic. A desperate man will always grasp at straws. A confident man chooses his own path in all things.

And to think, it took COVID to help me find that confidence. It was always there - i just didn't believe in myself.
Advert Space Available
Bypass censorship with https://1.1.1.1

Cloudflare 1.1.1.1
Reply



Bookmarks

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


t Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Kakis Invited for KTV Outings to Find " Very Attractive Gals" warbird Health Centre and KTV lounge Tangos 990 20-01-2024 11:44 AM
Chitchat Go DNA check yr mixed race type. Asia is diakect type... Sammyboy RSS Feed Coffee Shop Talk of a non sexual Nature 0 17-08-2017 07:00 AM
At wht age r gals most sexually attractive to u? kurupa Polls 24 18-06-2006 04:54 PM


All times are GMT +8. The time now is 02:55 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.10
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2024 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copywrong © Samuel Leong 2006 ~ 2025 ph